We are Taking Our Son Out of Cub Scouts

We haven’t told my son that we are pulling him out of Cub Scouts yet.

We haven’t told him because we want to sit down with him and talk about why. I have talked to him about the anti-gay policies that the Boy Scouts felt the need to reiterate a few weeks ago, and I told him why I believed that they were wrong, but since then my husband and I have talked more about it and decided that we cannot in good conscience let our child be a part of an organization that discriminates against people based on their sexual orientation. We don’t want him to think that this is okay, and we don’t want the Boy Scouts to think that we think it is acceptable.

We haven’t talked to him together because our family hasn’t been together. We are renovating our house and we don’t have a kitchen, or air conditioning, or walls. The kids and I have been traveling as much as possible this summer to stay out of the way of the contractors and plumbers and framers and the other people who leave their Chick Fil A cups in my yard reminding me that I can’t eat there anymore.

This is why it sucked so much yesterday when my son saw my brother’s Cub Scout uniform hanging in his closet at my parent’s house. “Wow” he said, with a reverent look. “Uncle Mike’s Cub Scout shirt”. Then my eight year old looked at all of the patches and compared what he had in common with his uncle. “Tiger, wolf. WOAH! He was a Webelo? Cool!”

And I tried not to cry.

This isn’t fair to my son. This isn’t fair to my brother. How can these close minded, paranoid, bigots ruin scouting for little boys everywhere? Scouting is about adventure. Scouting is about leadership. Scouting is about respect and education and camping.

Well, scouting was about all of those things. Now it is about civil rights. It has to be. We have to stand up and say that this is unacceptable or nothing will change. It is hard, and unpleasant, and I know that my little boy is going to cry when I tell him that he can’t be in scouts with his friends anymore and I hate making him cry.

My son’s den is full of kind leaders who are good tolerant men. My son’s den is full of wonderful boys, some of whom would not have been allowed in a white den 70 years ago. I like to think we have come a long way from those days, but here we are again.

How am I going to explain to him that his twin sister can stay in Brownies but he has to quit Boy Scouts?

5653749839 d21c2f0f82 We are Taking Our Son Out of Cub Scouts

I guess I will tell him that the Girl Scouts accept self-identifying girls no matter gender they were born with and that it makes me proud. I suppose I will explain that when hate groups threatened to boycott Girl Scout cookies because the GSUSA let 7 year old Bobby Montoya join a Brownies the Girl Scouts stood behind Bobby and his troop.

I will tell him that if the Boy Scouts reverse their policies of hate and intolerance he can rejoin the very next day, but that we probably shouldn’t hold our breath. We will talk to our son about discrimination and why it is wrong and we will take him camping and hiking ourselves. We will invite his friends to come with us.

And of course I will tell him that life isn’t fair, because it isn’t. And that really stinks.

 

 

 

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  1. Doug never let Michael be in cub scouts for this very reason. And it was hard when all of his friends did it but he had so many other activities he never really noticed. Maybe find something else he loves and try to replace it?

    Want to look for Indian Guides with me? They USED to have it when I was growing up and I can’t find it anymore.

  2. My husband was an eagle scout back in his day and he is so upset that our son won’t have that opportunity. He has great memories of his time as a scout, but we both agree this is something we can’t support.

  3. I completely agree with your decision, and COMPLETELY agree that it sucks.

    Yeah, there are tons and tons of wonderful, tolerant people in scouting, and I certainly doubt your son’s troop leaders would be attempting to indoctrinate any kind of right-wing agenda into his head. They’ll be tying knots and going camping and generally trying to have good experiences and help create good kids.

    And yet, like you, I find I am at the point that this issue is too important to ignore. I can’t pretend I don’t know what the organization’s position is. Will they know or care that this one mother in suburban Massachusetts keeps her son out of cub scouts? No. But it still matters.

    I don’t envy you the conversation with your son. I can’t imagine the heartbreak. But I hope someday he will understand, and he will know that you stood up for the right thing, even when it was incredibly hard.

  4. This is very well written, and I’m sorry this sucks. I am also very sad about Chick-Fil-A because I love their food, but knowing what we now know, I just can’t in good conscience give them our money.

    My 5-year-old twins are girls, but my 15-month-old is a boy, and my husband and I discussed his possible future in Boy Scouts in light of their recent decision. We are sad that unless something changes, he’ll be breaking a long family tradition of Scouting. But what else can we do?

  5. I’m so proud of you for doing what I can’t bring myself to do. I always justified scouting to myself by saying that our pack didn’t emphasize the religious components and all of the leadership seemed like open-minded, reasonable people. I got a little wigged out when I found out that each meal was lead with a (christian) prayer while he was at the week-long away camp, but it didn’t seem to bother him too much. The latest statement on the BSA’s opinions about homosexuality has my blood boiling, but I keep thinking that his troop wouldn’t kick any of the boys out for their sexuality. But what if my son is gay? How would it make him feel to have to stay closeted to continue to do something he enjoys?

    The whole situation is infuriating and steeped in hate and disgust. Why can’t grown adults act like grown ups and learn to be tolerant of everyone? Religion is fucking up the planet.

    • @delora, I got in trouble, on MORE than one occasion, about the prayers thing. I was raised hindu, so I would not participate in the church-sessions or the prayers. One of our assistant leaders one time tried to force me, telling me that I HAD to attend, it was MANDATORY. It’s NON DENOMINATIONAL we’re just praising JESUS (she had issues with the concept clearly).

      It almost escalated poorly as she started trying to physically force me, but my father was there on that trip and came up and asked her just what she thought she was doing. And when she started trying to get him to help her, he pointed out that he’s from India and is Hindu and had no intentions of going to the christian service and that I didn’t need to either. And that he’d be happy to have any other kids not interested in going hang out at our campsite. She went apopleptic and tried to find other leaders to explain to us how wrong we were.

      A pair of those other leaders took her by the arms and led her off to service, apologizing to us as they went. *sigh* It’s not supposed to be controversial, folks, it’s supposed to be educational and building!

      • @attriel – That is awful! The BSA org clearly states that scouts are supposed to be reverent, but in their own religion (and our pack made the point that the boys should attend their own faith’s services). Our issue is that we’re atheists, so have no faith to fall back on. I think it’s less of an issue for us since it’s just “going through the motions” for Christian prayers since we don’t believe in god, than actively praying to another religion’s deity. It drives be batty that Christians in this country always assume that everyone is Christian.

  6. I love you!!! And reading this post made me cry too.

  7. I’ve had issues with the BSA for a while (full disclosure: I am an Eagle Scout and I started in the very first year they had Tiger Cubs as a program). But when I was doing my Eagle work, I saw a number of other troops that churned out Eagles like machines. I saw projects that were little more than collecting cans for a food drive in the neighborhood. Some of which weren’t even being done by the boys so much as the parents and the troop leadership to keep counts high. And I saw a number of troops that were run like para-military organizations. I understand that Scouting WAS originally military in origins, but things like holding salutes when a higher-ranked member goes past, sir-yes-sir responses to everything, etc.

    And as much as I loved doing scouts, on my own in my own way and under my own control, I saw that ability eroding even in my own troop as I aged out. We weren’t big enough to be an Eagle Factory, and some of the longer-time leaders were stepping down, so those that were left were angling towards the paramilitary option. Telling boys which badges they had to work on, practicing “field maneuvers”. And I started questioning whether I’d ever be willing to put my own kids into that organization.

    That was a beef with implementation, not so much the core organization. And people told me I was crazy for thinking those things, that I was just bitter because I didn’t have the support to do more/better/whatever.

    But now? Now it’s no longer implementational. Now it’s organizational. And while I don’t think all, or even most, of the current scouts and leaders agree with the policy, I find myself thinking about it again. My son is five, and we might have looked at Tigers/Cubs (well, not withstanding his accident) this year. But I just don’t see it anymore.

    I wish I could find a non-BSA scouting organization that did the same kinds of things, I’d be tempted to give it a go. I’m sure they’re out there, but of course “scouts” on google returns only BSA and Girl Scouts …

    Good luck. Let us know what you decide to do as an alternative, if you find something!

    (And maybe that alternative will have something better than popcorn for a fundraiser; seriously, cute girls with cookies vs adolescent boys with microwave popcorn?)

  8. Yes, this is terribly sad. I have heard that it is the connection between BSA and the mormon church that makes this policy persist.

  9. Please don’t hate, just read first. I have just signed my son up for Boy Scouts. I am about to be a co-den mother. I don’t agree with the Boy Scouts policies – AT ALL. That being said, I will be the den mother that stands up for your sons. My brothers were boy scouts, I was a girl scout. Scouting has enriched our lives. It is unfair for our sons to miss out on such a wonderful experience because of the ignorant few. My suggestion is before you remove your son, talk it over with your Troop Leader/Den Mother/Father. I think you might find that there are more people like you than you think who still value the other stuff the boy scouts represent.

  10. There are a number of alternatives to the Boy Scouts that are inclusive. You could sign him up for one of those so he still had the camaraderie of kids his age. Camp Fire USA and Spiral Scouts are two big ones, and Camp Quest has a summer camp program.

  11. I know and love your child so much, and you know the LAST thing I’d ever want is to take away anything that brings him happiness and pride.

    But you know that I fully support and appreciate what you’re doing, the power of your conviction and your willingness to stand up against this organization that has gone out of its way to state that not all children or adult leaders are welcome, and in fact will be cruelly ejected, based on who they are. If the US military can host pride celebrations and abolish DADT, the Boy Scouts can get over themselves.

    I think that this example from you is what will make him the better person in the long run. And that is the shitty part of having convictions in the first place. I’m proud of you, too, what that’s worth. Everything about this summer seems to make me cry and cry, but this time it’s just in a strange solidarity for standing up for what is right, especially when it’s difficult.

    And I know how much you hate camping. So.

    I so love you.

  12. I am SO SO SO proud of you for making this decision. So proud. It is so incredibly difficult but what an amazing thing you are teaching your family.

    Our neighbor across the street is a den leader and we had to have the difficult conversation that Nate and Alex won’t be in boy scouts for the same reason. Conversation killer.

  13. Thank you for standing up even though it may be one of the hardest parenting decisions you will ever make. I’ve been a “let’s stick with it and try to change things from the inside” with a lot of organizations over the years and, as I’ve gotten older, I’m realizing that sometimes the strongest way to make a statement is to leave the room. My son was set to be the 4th generation of his family to be an eagle scout. (he’s related to more than 20 of them) His BSA career ended before it started.

    It’s a hard call, but you’re doing the right thing.

  14. This just sucks. I totally agree with you, and would do the same thing, but it sucks.

  15. I respect your decision, especially since it clearly was a tough one, and I agree with your objections to the Boy Scouts.

    However, I also agree with the commenters who recommended that you check with your local leaders before making the decision final. Our son is not in scouting – don’t know if he’ll ever have any interest or what we’ll do about it if he does – but I have heard local Minnesota Scout leaders say that they are free, at the local level, to set their own policies about inclusiveness, and that they disagree with and openly disregard the stance of the national Scout leaders when it comes to gay kids and leaders.

    It might not make any difference to you – association with the Boy Scouts is association with the Boy Scouts, and I understand why you don’t want that. But when they covered this story in our local news, I felt really bad for the leaders who are trying to make scouting a positive experience for *all* kids, and are tainted by the policies everybody hears about in the national coverage.

  16. It’s the right thing. Good-but tough-decision! My son is in the same boat. Boy Scouts is not an option for him due to their discriminatory practices.

  17. That’s so hard. It really does suck that your boy will be sad, but it’s really the organization that let him down, not you, even if he has trouble seeing that. I hope you find something fun for him to participate in that can replace it soon.

  18. smart aleck says:

    I think you guys made the right call on this issue. Even if the local level does things right, you are still a part of the bigger organization. Two hundred years ago if the plantation owner didn’t beat his slaves while the neighbor did, it didn’t make everything right because he was still a slave owner.

    I’d like to see the BSA get their act together because one day I’ll have a son–my husband was a cub scout and this is one less argument I’d like to have (he claims to be open minded but still doesn’t take the public stands I’d like him to take…I blame the Baptist upbringing. Or his inability to confront anyone who isn’t me). But if they don’t, I will dig my heels in and win this battle at home.

    I love that you explain things to your kids and treat them as the adults they will soon be. Meanwhile, create a bunch of the activities on your own. Hell, the living in a crazy renovation space is practically camping–give him a patch for one! Cleaning up after the work guys–same as adopting a highway. Scooping up after the cats…nature badge.

    At least the Olympics got it right by disqualifying the cheating badminton players.

  19. You’re not going to make much of a statement by pulling him out as you would by staying in and being vocal about it.

    Washington State is currently in a gay marriage issue, where it was legalized. My church group was asked to gather signatures to get the referrendum on the ballot to rescind the law. I refused. While my church did not gather signatures (due in no small part to me) the referrendum made it onto the ballot and we as a state will be voting whether or not to rescind gay marriage.

    My point – change will only come from within.

    My son is in Cub Scouts. I am active in the church. Both activities will continue. I am vehemently in favor of gay marriage. You can stay in and make the statement that way. It will be much more effective and impactful.

  20. We just had this discussion with my son. He so badly wants to be in scouts since Y Guides ended last year (a father/son program run through the YMCA that is similar to scouting in some ways). We told him the same thing you are going to tell your son, and he was upset but totally understood. We’ve always talked to our sons about issues like this in an age appropriate context. I am confident they will be better people for it. Kudos to you.

  21. We moved into a really great neighborhood 3 years ago and I quickly became involved in the school our kids go to, as well as the community.
    It’s been talked about and even joked that, “Well we can count on another leader and popcorn coordinator once Kevin’s son is ready for Cub Scouts.”
    No they can’t. I thought that even before the latest bigotry from the organization got handed down.
    Do organizations, such as Boy Scouts, offer activities and great outlets for kids? Indeed. However as long as they are run by idiots, count us out. I have had to explain to our kids about this type of thing on many different levels.
    I’m with you on this.

  22. We made the decision long ago not to put my boys in Boy Scouts. I know someone who was big into BSA, was a group leader (or whatever it’s called, sorry don’t know the lingo) and was involved at the State level for my home state. And then he left because of the BSA’s exclusionary policies. This was long before I even had my kids, so it was easy for me to make the decision to not put them in BSA.

    I can’t imagine how hard it is to pull him out once he’s in. Honestly I don’t know what I would do. My gut reaction would be to pull him out, but like others have mentioned, there are certainly benefits to the BSA organizations. I can teach them what I want at home, but then again, the BSA can teach them things too. I just don’t know. I think in the end, I would pull them out, try to explain why as best I could, and find something else for them to be involved in.

  23. BaltimoreGal (Ann) (@BaltimoreGal) says:

    I can’t imagine doing any other thing. The Girl Scouts should open a boys’ auxiliary.

  24. I wrestle with this myself. I allow Louis to be in, because I want him to choose not to be in, on his own. At this point in his life, it’s about playing with other little boys which is something he doesn’t get much of because of his brothers. He doesn’t see the big picture of bigotry.
    But he’s a good kid, and he will see it some day.
    I feel like when he sees it himself, he’ll have made that decision on his own, and learned something.

    I also think that just like anything, change is only possible if different kinds of people participate. I’m a liberal atheist, and I allow my son to be a Boy Scout.

    I get where you are coming from. I feel the OH HELL NO quite seriously. We didn’t allow him to do stuff at the Y because it said you had to bring your Bible and we were just like ummm, no.

    That’s such a hard choice though, I think you’re right. I agree with you – I’m just getting to the same place differently.

  25. Jenn Walpole says:

    Sarah, this post made me cry. It makes me so sad for Ian, and so sad that you have to do this. But it also makes me so proud and hopeful that in a world filled with endless hate and vitriol, there are people in the world, our friends, doing what’s right, not just what’s easy. Really proud of you guys, Mama. xoxo

  26. Good for you Sarah. This is one of the worst types of parenting decisions out there: Taking away something your child loves for reasons they cannot yet fully understand. Maybe you’ll find you like camping after all? You know, practice makes perfect. Anyway, my boys would be happy to join yours camping anytime!

  27. This is a beautiful and heartbreaking post.

    I think this is a very personal decision. There are those who can try to change Scouting from within, and I truly do respect that. However, I won’t put my son into a situation where the institution he is a part of might in anyway discourage him from being who he truly is. The harm of Scouting’s policies is not just to those children and potential scout masters who are barred from participating, but to the children who are conditioned into closeting themselves to remain part of a community they love and which has much to admire in it.

  28. Given the BSA’s stance on atheism, we wouldn’t have been welcome anyway, but both that and their position on homosexuality has kept us from buying popcorn for years.

    I’m sorry that this move will hurt your son, but he is taking a positive role in history. That’s something to be proud of, something that may mean more than memorabilia when he tells the story to his own kids – kids who will be astounded that organizations ever discriminated on the basis of faith or sexuality.

  29. What a heartbreaking decision. You have to do what you feel is the right thing. I have several good childhood friends who did Scouts all through highschool, and became Eagle Scouts. And you know what? A couple of them came out in college or later as gay. I can’t even imagine how they feel now, for having achieved so much with an organization that now would not accept them as leaders. My husband and I discuss this, because the Boy Scouts do a lot of great things. He says he doesn’t think the anti-gay policy is really enforced at the local level, so it doesn’t matter. But I’m not so sure. I’m not sure I would want to support an organization in any way that has intolerance as one of its principles. I didn’t know about their stance on atheism (thanks, Julie Marsh!) and we’re that, too, so yeah, maybe this is not the right organization for my soon-to-be born son. Sarah, I’m so sorry for this hard decision. It’s so hard to know what the “right” answer is, and it’s so, so, SO hard to knowingly make your kid unhappy.

  30. I’m really conflicted about this. I mean, I think you are doing the right thing, but I can’t yet bring myself to do it. We are a very liberal town, but we wind up having a relatively high number of Eagle Scouts year to year because there’s nothing else to do here. There isn’t, that I have yet heard, any anti-gay message coming from local leaders, but if I ever heard one, out we’d go.

    What bothers me most about BSA’s stance is that, as with the Catholic Church, it appears to be their way of not taking responsibility for a molestation scandal that happened years ago. I’d say that such a message was the impetus for me finally leaving the Church, but the truth is I was on the way out the door already for a whole host of reasons. That didn’t help.

    I really hope that you are able to find a new group for Ian to join. Or start one (oops, did I say that?)!

  31. As a queer person and a former Girl Scout who has been enraged about the criticisms thrown at the GSUSA over the past year with regard to their amazing inclusiveness, I wanted to thank you. I know that it will be challenging for your son, not just with regard to the friends + awesome activities component. But you are doing a really spectacular thing by teaching him that doing the right thing should be prioritized over opportunities to experience personal joy…especially because doing the right thing is often more joyful than seeking out personal rewards! It makes good citizens out of us all to be in service to others, including by standing up for what’s right, whatever the costs may be.

    I also disagree with the people suggesting that a more tolerant local-level troop atmosphere might be “enough”. Taking your son out of scouting and making a clear statement about why sends a message to not only your local troop, but the organization as a whole. What I hope is that if enough parents do this, things will start to change on a global level, which in turn will make things better for other boys in small, bigoted towns who don’t have sanctuary like a more tolerant troop. Think globally, act locally might be a gigantic cliche, but in the case of this particular topic, I think it’s the most responsible way to act. I also encourage you to write a letter to your local troop leaders, CCing the Boy Scouts of America’s top ranking officials, and perhaps his school’s principal and/or the supervisor of wherever troop meetings are held.

  32. Try Campfire USA – this is what we plan for our son when he is old enough, and expresses an interest.

    http://www.campfireusa.org/index.aspx

    Good for you, there are many reasons to keep our sons out of the BSA.

  33. This moves me, on so many levels. I ache for you trying to explain the inexplicable to him, and have so much awe for people like you who are doing hard things in such a compassionate way. Thank you for sharing this post.

  34. I think that you are doing the absolute right thing, and it sucks that you have to do it. Good luck with the conversation. Even if your son doesn’t understand now I’m sure that someday he will.

  35. My son was in Cub Scouts until 3rd Grade, when we decided that he had outgrown it. He had a great deal of fun with some of the events, and there was never any anti-gay or anti-anybody sentiment at our local meetings. If anything, they attempted to make it as inclusive and multi-cultural as possible. I was very sad to hear that the Boy Scouts had come out with this anti-gay statement. I probably would have done the same thing.

  36. Seeing all of this in the headlines now, brings back the memories of 15 years ago when we had the same talk with my son. However, we let him make the decision himself. He was almost 8 and we told him about the Supreme Courts decision, he of course thought it was crazy and he chose to no longer be a part of such an organization. It hurt us, as my brother was an Eagle Scout (he passed away before the decision and if I could find his medal I would return it on his behalf!) and my mother was his den leader. My daughter is a Gold Award Girl Scout and all of my sisters and I are lifetime members of Girl Scouts USA.
    SOmeday, people will realize that everyone’s blood is the same.

  37. With you 100%, Sarah. I also sympathize with those who would like to change the system from within – but I expect that if they can’t get results they should remove their children from harmful environments.

  38. OK, I don’t usually post, but you asked for an opinion. My husband and I raised two sons — not same sex parents. I don’t think it matters. The boy scouts are just WEIRD! I’m sorry, but neither of my sons had very good experiences. They are bi-racial (now in their 30′s) — but in Berkeley that shouldn’t have been a big deal — even back then. Their dad was in the boyscouts as a kid too. And he told me some pretty sick stuff that went on. My advice is a no vote — especially if he’s young. The older Eagle Scouts are REALLY strange, and liked to do fraternity type stuff with the younger boys. OK, I guess I’ve said enough. I suppose if you know the scout leader and the kids pretty well, it could be a good experience, but if not, I wouldn’t take the chance. -Just my opinion. Marilyn PS: Again JUST my opinion based on limited and old experience.

  39. You are making an enormous mistake. One that you will not ever be able to go back and fix. You are hurting your child in so many ways. The scouting experience is an incredible learning opportunity for young men.

    You say “My son’s den is full of kind leaders who are good tolerant men. My son’s den is full of wonderful boys, some of whom would not have been allowed in a white den 70 years ago. I like to think we have come a long way from those days, but here we are again.”

    These are the people your son will be learning from. He will be learning honesty and integrity from good leaders. You are worried about an issue that will has virtually no chance to impact him through his scouting tenure. Yet you will be depriving him of one of the most incredible opportunities for young boys to learn leadership and responsibility.

    The civil rights fight is not at your son’s troop level. These “kind leaders” see to that for you. Your son’s experience comes from the troop level.

    The main thing that you are teaching your son is that one can NEVER cause change from within. The only path is through running away. Let your son stay in Scouting. Get involved. If more parents would get involved you can change the organization. Pulling your children will ensure that there will not ever be change.

    • I agree with Wayne 100%.

      Bigotry and intolerance must be fought, but I’m not convinced that taking our ball and going home is the best way to go about it.

      It seems to me that the most effective way is to claim our spot and refuse to budge.

    • I agree with Wayne also. Scouting is a great experience! Let you child experience it. There is hate all over the world – are you going to lock your kid in the basement until grows up?

    • I concur with Wayne, as Cub Scout leader myself, I focus on providing a fun, “do your best” and be a good citizen program for all my Scouts. It is really difficult to read that your son won’t be allowed to participate in an organization based on the policies set forth from a few. I focus on leadership and responsibility and believe it or not, a large percentage of men with careers in politics and government were in Cub or Boy Scouts at one time.
      My brother in law is gay, I love him. We each have our beliefs and as much as you are taking a stance for your son, there is a message in it that says he should be “intolerant” of those who do share his beliefs. Imagine, your son’s teacher, a coach, a mentor, etc.; do you know their beliefs and would you pull him from all those experiences? There is a good chance they have their own beliefs that differ greatly from you. I hope you will change your mind and let him have a voice to stay in Scouts. He sees the uniform for what it should be, an experience in “cool” things like camping, community service, doing a good turn and handy skills, not as a civil rights war. As a leader, I do not focus on the “sexuality” policies and I think it fair you should talk with your son’s.

  40. I’m confused about the chick fil a comment. Why can’t you eat there any more? Is it because the owner believes differently than you do? It’ll take a lot of work to ferret out the beliefs of all the owners of stores and restaurants that you shop at. What about your remodelers, your mortgage company, whoever it is that collects the trash? Can you not patronize any business that believes differently, or is it just ones who say it out loud? And would they be wrong for not buying what you sell, or does it only work one way, because there is only one right way, and that is yours?
    I find that “tolerance” is generally very one-sided.

  41. I am actually at a loss for words. I can imagine what a tough decision this was. But, I want to say thank you. When families like yours stand up to bigotry, you push us all that much closer to equality.

  42. Wow, that really does suck, but I am proud of you and your husband for the stance you’ve taken. After all of this went down, I made a point of looking up the equivalent information on the Scouts Canada website, and I found their policy: “Scouts Canada does not discriminate for reasons of gender, culture, religious belief or sexual orientation.”

    Maybe you could enroll him here? ;) Someday he will understand all of this better, but it’s such an important “teachable moment” and doing the right thing is usually harder than doing the “easy thing.”

  43. My son is 5, and for this very reason we are looking into 4-H. When the case first went to the Supreme Court, 4-H filed a brief siding with the gay scout master.
    From what I understand, the county 4-H breaks down into interest clubs. So, if you want to be a leader, you could declare that your club is focused on camping, etc.

  44. tell ian that peter is out too…we can now start our lil troop we were talking about ;)

  45. I just want to be clear that when the policy is reversed he can rejoin if he chooses to do so.

  46. Steve and Larry’s son is a cub scout. And I always buy the popcorn from him, because I can’t very well tell *him* that I won’t buy popcorn because of how the organization feels about “teh gays.”

    But the new next door neighbor kid – with hetero parents – is a cub scout, and I’ll have no problem telling him that I won’t buy his popcorn because of the group’s hate stance.

    If Lumpyhead asks, I’ll just tell him it’s complicated. And that he can never be a Cub Scout, because his father hates bugs, I fucking hate camping, and some kids were just not bred for the out-of-doors, son.

    And please tell me Jodi was kidding about the Indian Guide thing. Gah.

  47. Imagine a boy who was a Cub Scout for years, then goes on to Boy Scouts. Maybe he earns his First Class, Star and LIfe ranks and is working on his Eagle. He graduates into Explorer scouts. Maybe his post works with a police department and he wants to go into the Marines, be an MP, and then afterward be a cop. Now suppose this kid realizes he’s gay. Scouting will kick him out and he can’t earn his Eagle that he’s worked so hard for over many years. That isn’t fair. Even if they won’t allow gay adult leaders, kids shouldn’t be kicked out just because somewhere along the line they realize they are gay.

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